Doula Support That Actually Helps

Birth prep gets marketed like a checklist, but the hard parts usually show up in the gaps: the first painful latch, the exhaustion at 2 a.m., the moment you realize you do not know the right question to ask a nurse or doctor. We wanted to talk about the real experience, so we brought on Shannon Allen, a postpartum doula and lactation care provider and the founder of Desires of the Heart Doula and Lactation Care in Columbia, South Carolina.

Shannon breaks down what a doula actually does and how that differs from a midwife, then goes deeper into the kind of support most families wish they had sooner. We get into breastfeeding support and the stigma around it, why “natural” does not mean “easy,” and how small tools and simple visuals can stop parents from spiraling when they think they are not producing enough milk. She also shares her own three very different birth stories, including moments that were scary, exhausting, and ultimately grounding, plus a reminder of how powerful a steady partner or support person can be.

We also talk advocacy and informed consent: how to speak up, how to ask what is happening to your body, and why a good doula focuses on empowering you rather than talking for you. If you are researching postpartum doula care, lactation consulting, breastfeeding help, or the midwife vs doula decision, this conversation is built to leave you more prepared and less alone.

If this helped you, subscribe, share it with an expecting parent, and leave a review so more families can find the support they deserve. Happy Mother's Day to all the incredible moms we love!

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 1:45

Welcome back to the Hilltop Glove Podcast. And today we are thrilled to have the amazing Shannon Allen, a devoted mother of three and inspiring entrepreneur. She is the founder of Desires of the Heart, Doula and Lactation Care, where she offers care, compassion, and emotional support to new parents. Her services include educational resources and convenient online scheduling to assist families throughout their birth and postpartum journey. Stay tuned while we explore motherhood with Shannon. How are you? Good. Thank you so much. I told her before the episode started, we could be related because we have the same last name. Yes.

SPEAKER_04 2:27

We related somehow.

SPEAKER_03 2:29

Exactly. So we like to start off the beginning of the episode. Just tell us a little bit about yourself, where you're from, your if you have any siblings, and who inspired you growing up.

SPEAKER_04 2:40

Okay, great. So I am from Orange Bird, South Carolina. I moved to Columbia with my husband. I have um an older sister. We are 15 months apart. I love her to death. Um I'm a loving mother, three, like you said. My oldest is 11, 6, and 3. So we have a w a wide range. Love it. Um and a little bit by myself. I always love babies. Um in high school, I was in the child development classes. I love anything about kids. Just learning them, um, relating to them, teaching them. It just always was my passion. Um can we? Y'all gonna cut this out? Yeah, we can. Oh, okay. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 3:26

Okay. Yeah, take your time.

SPEAKER_03 3:29

So what caught my eye when you said what caught my attention when you said that is that you love teaching kids. So what advice would you give to someone who teaches kids?

SPEAKER_04 3:37

Take your time day by day. Yeah. Um, while you're teaching them, you also learn it from them. So we always feel like sometimes you can't learn anything from a child, but you can. So kids teach you how to be free and let go sometimes. And I believe in learning lessons from my kids as well. They teach me how to be a better person.

unknown 3:58

Yeah.

Breastfeeding Challenges And Stigma

SPEAKER_02 3:59

Man, so I know I met you for the first time a couple weeks ago. Yeah. Um, through like my nine to five um stuff. And one of the things that I re I didn't realize, especially when it came to um what you do, I didn't realize you did do a and lactation consulting.

SPEAKER_05 4:14

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 4:14

Man, I wish I'd have known you five years ago. Man.

unknown 4:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 4:19

I don't want to tell you. I don't want to tell you, man. So, because I remember just like when we when our daughter came home, like that was like the blade the night shifts. Yeah. Man, and then on top of it, like, you know, we were trying to, you know, we were trying to breastfeed her, too. And I know my wife struggled with that at first. But eventually she got it. But it was just a lot of work. And I didn't even understand what a doula was. Like for many, many years, I thought a doula was a midwife. And a midwife was a doula. Okay, so can you explain for those of us who are ignorant in the world on what a doula and a midwife is, what's what each of them are or what's the difference?

SPEAKER_04 4:54

Yeah, I can. First, I'm gonna circle back to the point about breastfeeding. So I like to tell people breastfeeding is natural, but it's not easy. Um I think that was my push to become a lactation consultant, was um, breastfeeding with my first child. I knew I wanted to breastfeed, but I didn't know anybody that did it. It wasn't Facebook, Facebook groups back then. It wasn't a lot of outlets for help. And I never forget, I was determined to breastfeed. Um, my mom, she brought me a small can of formula, and she was like, just in case, so you won't put that pressure on yourself. And my biggest reward was when I threw that thing out because it expired. Um, I breastfed all three of my kids. Even being certified, I remember with my daughter, it just couldn't click. It was a traumatic birth experience. So I felt like I couldn't remember, and I was beating myself up because I'm like, you certified, you know this, you do this every day, you help people. But what was my biggest help and my advocate was my husband. He was like, Shannon, try this position, try that position. And I'm like, look at you, sir. But that's why it's important about educating not just the mom but the family support system. So breastfeeding is natural, but it's not easy. It's a beautiful experience, but it can be tiresome.

SPEAKER_02 6:15

Yeah. And I don't get um there's a lot of stigma covers breastfeeding, too. Um and I guess for me, that's something that I was never necessarily bothered by, but I know for a lot of people, male and female, there's an issue with breastfeeding. Yeah. So where do you think all that comes from?

SPEAKER_04 6:31

Um, we sexualized breasts. So we took the actual meaning of what your breasts are made for, and we turned it into a sexual thing. So um, breastfeeding is your breasts were made to breastfeed. Now, granted, it isn't for everyone, and that's okay. But to actually, God designed your body in such a beautiful way that every part of your body is made for something, and that is made to feed your child. Like, think about it. You can seriously feed your child with your own body, with nothing added, until you are ready to introduce foods to your child. So it's a beautiful thing. Yeah. And the stigma of it is that back in the day, years um, right after slavery, when black people were, you know, on the up and up, right? So the stigma was if you breastfed, you couldn't afford formula. So for black women back in the day to say, oh, I can't afford formula, I do have a certain status. They went ahead and purchased formula instead of breastfed. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 7:36

Yeah. But can you talk about um I guess the effects of breastfeeding compared to formula? Because I've heard about lawsuits with formula having these different ingredients inside of it, and it's not healthy for the child. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 7:50

So you always see on some cans, it's a just like breast milk, just like mom. Nothing is like being natural. It's almost like us comparing a fake flower to a real one. Nothing compares to actually that real flower because over time it's gonna dwindle, it's gonna die on its own. Um, breast milk is about the same. So it has its own natural components. Actually, your child's saliva would tell your breast what all you need would tell your body. So you have your antibiotics in there, you have your your um anything to help grow and help the child develop, it's in your breast. So um I think the coolest thing was, and this guy I really knew, like breast milk was it. My um my daughter in her classroom, hand foot and mouth was going wrong. And if you're a parent that ever did with hand foot and mouth, it is a battle. Yeah. It is a battle. So um I was still breastfeeding her during that time. My middle son, I wasn't breastfeeding him, but they both drunk out my cup. Okay. So my daughter didn't get hand foot and mouth. My son did. Oh, wow. Because her saliva was telling my breast everything that she needed, all the different antibiotics that she needed. So she never caught it. But my son did. And let me tell you something, you can always use your breast milk on your other kids to. Um, what I did was I gave him some breast milk. I couldn't tell him because at that age he was too cool to know, you know, that he's drinking breast milk. But even putting it in the bath, even putting it in um his grease, it helped clear it up.

SPEAKER_05 9:27

I don't like that.

SPEAKER_04 9:29

Okay, and now I know I went around the Marbury bush, but to answer your question about the doolists and the midwives. So, doulas, we are emotional and physical support. We don't deliver, we don't catch the babies. Okay. The midwife, uh almost like your O B G Y N. Okay. They're there to assess uh assess you deliver the baby. Okay.

unknown 9:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:48

Okay, good. Because for some reason, I don't know why for years and years I've always thought they were the same thing. And I always, and like, and I know this is wrong, because like stereotypes, you know, you like use stereotype things. Yeah. And I was always thinking about it that could do like a natural hair woman. Yeah. And like they just, you know, say, you know, just relax, you know, at each, you know.

SPEAKER_04 10:06

But we do have that flow about us. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:11

It's just, it's just because I know a lot of people don't know. That's what I'm asking these questions.

SPEAKER_04 10:14

And I think more with the doulas, we are like more holistic because we believe in more natural care. Um with me, myself, I try to find a natural remedy versus going to um buying something over the counter or appeals or anything. So that natural aspect is a part of the doula life. Cool.

SPEAKER_02 10:34

So um, as a doula, um, so you're pretty much present after the baby's born when the baby's whole. So, how long do y'all work with a family?

Three Birth Stories With Hard Moments

SPEAKER_04 10:43

It depends on how long the family needs. Some people might need you maybe three weeks, and some people might need you six months. But I believe like once I'm there for a family, we're family. Yeah. So um, I think one thing a lot of people don't realize is that when you select your doula, it's an agreement between the two of you. So maybe you feel like this doula is a match for you, and maybe the doula don't feel that. So they could refer you out, and vice versa, you know. Um, so that's how we have that bond and that connection. Because while we're in that birthing space, I need you to trust me and I need you to listen to me, and vice versa, I need to listen to you. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 11:22

So um, could you tell us a little bit about your own birthing experiences? What were they like?

SPEAKER_04 11:27

Yeah, so all three of them were totally different. They were my oldest son, I was in active labor with him for 24 hours. Um, my body rejected epiderm. I had it twice. They tried to do it a third time, and my husband intervened and was like, no, we're not gonna do that. And I'm so thankful for that because at that time I felt like I was an experiment. I remember they told my family that they had to walk out the room while they did it. And I remember hearing the lady say, Oh, I think I did it wrong. So as soon as they came back in, I was like, Chris, this is what happened. And I told them. And then I remember I went to sleep for a while and then I came back. So um that's scary. Very scary, yeah. I remember her saying she did it wrong. And my family wasn't in there with me. It was just me and them. Exactly. Yeah. Um, but had a beautiful, healthy baby after 24 hours. Um, no, excuse me, 28 hours with him. And he was nine pounds, two ounces.

SPEAKER_02 12:29

Oh, that's why it's for 24 hours.

SPEAKER_04 12:31

Yeah. My big baby. And then my second son, I remember them telling me, oh, this would be a breeze. You already had a baby, he'll just slide right out. That was not the case. I was in active labor with him for 10 hours. I remember my sister taking my oldest son to school, and he had come back, and I still was in labor. And I was in so much pain because my body rejects Epidurum. Um, I remember I had told, don't bring him up here yet. I don't want him to see me like this. I was just in so much pain. And with all my labor experiences, my husband has always been right there beside me. And I remember he played gospel music and we was just singing and just trying to pass the time. And um he was fasting right there with me. He wouldn't eat or drink anything. And I was like, Chris, you could drink something. He wouldn't do anything. Um, and I had my beautiful baby as well. He was eight pounds, seven ounces. And then my last one, okay, they said, Oh, this is your third child, she's gonna slide out. At that time, I had no doulas for any of my praxies. Um with her, they said, Oh, this is your third child, she's gonna slide out, it's gonna be a breeze. Uh-uh, not again. She uh, I was in at death labor with her for 24 hours. She was stuck on my pelvis bone. And then I remember the doctor coming in and saying that, well, if she doesn't move, we're gonna end up having to have a C-section. And at that time, I was in so much pain, I was okay with that. I was at peace with it. Um, I remember my mom, she was crying. She was just so nervous. And I looked at her, I said, I'm okay, I'm at peace. I'm at peace with it. So my husband, he went scrubbing up. He got dressed head to toe, he was ready. Um we he held my hand the whole time we were in there. Um we had her, and I remember I saw her maybe for like two minutes, and they rushed her to the NICU. And Christmas between me and the NICU going back and forth, back and forth. Um, after 12 hours, I was finally able to hold my baby. So that was so difficult. Um, she had some issues with her lungs, and I remember them saying, Well, if we can't get her stable, we're gonna take her to the children's hospital. So Maya, I'm in the recovery room, and I looked at Chris. I was like, You got our bags ready? Because she's not going by herself. Um, but thank the Lord she was fine. And um just breastfeeding her for the first time was just a beautiful experience. Um, and because we knew that she was our last child, we we I actually breastfed her for two years.

unknown 15:18

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 15:19

Man, so I gotta give I gotta give him credit, give her his credit for that. Oh yeah. One of the things I was I was horrible as a husband when my wife was giving the baby. I'm gonna tell you why. I'm gonna tell you why. Because this is so funny. This is a funny joke, she'll laugh at me because of this. So when she was in labor, you know, they you know, you can't. I didn't realize, of course, you can't eat because you gotta be able to push.

SPEAKER_04 15:42

Well, that's what the hospital tells you. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 15:46

So for surgery. So they gave her freeze pops, right? Yeah, I was okay, cool. She's cool. I'm gonna go down to the cafeteria and I'm gonna start to eat. And so I went down there and I got this fantastic Asian salad.

SPEAKER_04 15:58

Not fantastic.

SPEAKER_02 15:59

It was fantastic. And I walked up, then I came back up to the room, but I was eating the salad. And I didn't think nothing up. Yeah, I didn't think nothing up, right? And like after and after she, you know, and everything. It's so bad for you, I'm sure. Right, right. That was so horrible. That was so horrible. And so, and it's funny too, because every time we we talk about her, we talk about um her giving birth, she always breaks that up. If he had enough nerves, be sitting up there and he did an agent salad. I'm like, the salad was good, that good, not enough for us to keep bringing it up. Yeah, I should've ate the salad. I should've just been, I should've just, I should have supported her and just ate a freeze pop too.

SPEAKER_04 16:42

But you could ate it outside the room. But outside the room.

Night Doulas And The 10cm Visual

SPEAKER_02 16:47

I did. I did. And I think the biggest thing is, and this, um, so as a dueler, like, do you guys help, like, I know you help out at home. Like, do you kind of help parents get a rest? Like, if they need to get some sleep, do you kind of do you kind of like service as like an in-house um babysitter in a science?

SPEAKER_04 17:04

So we do have some nighttime duelists that will stay with um mom and baby. Um they so if mom's breastfeeding, what she would do is she would wake mom up, hey, breastfeed the baby, and then she'll take the baby back. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 17:21

I know you got some stuff here. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 17:23

So these are yeah, so I love to use this as a demo. And sometimes I have dad, so I'm gonna use you as an example, okay? So through the 10 centimeters, put your arm through. Go all the way up, put it all the way up. That's how wide a mom has to open for the baby to come through. Sometimes you need that visual to see. That's how wide the servants has to open for mom to deliver a baby. You know, you hear 10 centimeters, but when you actually see it, yeah. That's crazy. Yeah. I love to use that as an example.

SPEAKER_02 18:02

It doesn't like seeing it in real life.

SPEAKER_04 18:04

That's why you have to give mom her flowers. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:07

That's what's going to episode.

SPEAKER_03 18:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:10

Check it out.

SPEAKER_03 18:12

I'm so skinny, it's gonna go up my hole.

SPEAKER_02 18:17

It is wild because you gotta think about it. That's how we all got here. Like we all have to do a 10-centimeter hole.

SPEAKER_03 18:22

Well, some, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:23

Some, some, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 18:24

That should be the name of the episode.

SPEAKER_02 18:26

10 centimeter hole.

SPEAKER_03 18:27

There you go. So, what do you think is the most rewarding part of your being a doula?

SPEAKER_04 18:34

Uh, that moment right when baby comes, it is like a joyful moment. Honestly, I feel like God is in the room during that time. Oh, I rejoice so much. I just it just I love to step back and look at mom and dad during that time. Um, sometimes I have mom and dad's phone because if I'm under labor, I always take one of their phones and take pictures. I never take pictures on my personal phone. Um, and I like to snap a picture of dad in that moment too. I like to see his face. I like to see mom's face, just that joy of, oh, I did it. I did it. That's a beautiful moment. Yeah. So that's my greatest reward. And then years down the line when I see baby thriving, mom thriving, the family, especially if somebody comes back a re-inter a re-occur. Excuse a re-incurring client, you know, just to come back, as that makes me feel like I did a great job.

unknown 19:37

Good, good.

SPEAKER_02 19:37

So um, well, I gotta ask. So, have you how many re-occurring clients have you had? I had two. Okay, cool. Awesome, awesome.

SPEAKER_04 19:43

Now I haven't been doing the doula scene much. Um, and actually, I recently transitioned to a postpartum doula doula since my husband passed.

SPEAKER_02 19:51

Okay, okay. Okay, good, good.

SPEAKER_03 19:54

What are some like misconceptions about being a doula that you would like to clear up? Um, that people can't afford a doula.

SPEAKER_04 20:02

Yeah. And I say that for myself as well, because I didn't have a doula for none of my three kids. Okay. And I felt at that time like, oh, we can't afford it. We're having a baby coming. We need to save and put that money towards what's to come. However, there are so many different resources and programs. We have the Black Doolers of Columbia that actually does a lot of free doula work, education. Um, now we have insurance companies seeing the valuable, valuable roles that doulas play, and they're actually helping cut the costs. Yeah. So um I think that's huge. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 20:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 20:43

And um, what's all included in, I guess, the fee of paying for a doula? Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 20:50

So what's included is um we have education classes, we I prep mom, I prep dad. Anybody that's gonna be your support system, they are welcome to any of the classes. I do a lot of in-home visits, you know, to see your environment. You're more comfortable at home. So let me see where you're gonna have the baby. Let me see what I can do to help you in this space. Um, I had a dad that never changed a pamper before. So we went over how to change pampers, you know, how to swallow a baby, um, safe sleep tactics. Um, so you get those classes beforehand. Then um, we do different birthing exercises. So, like I ball here, I bring this, and we'll we'll get on the floor, we'll do different exercises, show you how to open your pelvis, how to prepare for birth. Um then if you have kids, we'll work with siblings, sibling care. So, yeah, I believe in, and I think that was one of the greatest things for us is that we gave each child a little duty when the baby came. So you'll be on wipe duties, you'll always bring us the wipes, you'll always bring us the pamphers. And my oldest son, he said, I help, but I'm not changing no diapers. Cool. I'm grateful for the help. Cool. I don't want you to do that. But um allowing them to feel like they have a part in it, that helps out a lot. Okay. Especially for older kids, if they can read, here you're gonna read to the baby. This will be y'all time together. So you have that and the cost as well. Um, then the actual day of. So when my client turned um 34 weeks, I'm gonna call 24-7. Okay. Anytime you need me. Um, and before then, I am too, but just more 24-7. Um, the day of when my client says, hey, I have reached four centimeters, I'm up, I'm going to the hospital. And I'm there for usually 24 hours if mom hasn't had the baby within that time. And then we always have a backup doula. So with that, mom family has already, they already been introduced to our backup doula, they're okay with them. And then they'll come in my place, let me get some rest, and then I come back stronger. And then after that, because I'm certifying lactation, if mom decides she wants to breastfeed, I do go to a home and help with that. I go to the hospital and help with that as well. And then anything for up to three to four weeks after baby, we're there. But if mom needs extra time, we're there too.

unknown 23:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 23:22

That's full support system. Oh yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah. And it's a full circle, yeah. I even had um one of the babies, they just turned one and mom reached out to me because she had some concerns. And I love that because I love being able to still see the baby, interact with the baby, but still give mom and dad space that they need to grow as parents because you have to make those mistakes. I mean. You have to test some things out on your own, but just know that you have a safe land and somebody to fall back on.

SPEAKER_05 23:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 23:53

Now tell us about your props that you have up here.

SPEAKER_04 23:55

Yeah, okay. So this one here is our birthing cone, and it's actually to help mom during delivery. So we we realize that if you squeeze this and put the pressure in your palm, it kind of takes some of the pressures off your pelvis. Yeah. So if you heard the old myth that you can't two feel two, you can't feel two pains at one time, that's what this is to help with. Yeah. So when mom's in labor, she'll put it around her wrist and then she would actually squeeze it, squeeze it tight. Instead of the father's hand. Yes. That saves hands.

unknown 24:31

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 24:32

This has helped a lot. And mom squeeze it really tight, and that helps. And it doesn't damage her hands or anything. Yeah. At that point, you you just want to get rid of the pain. Right. And I love this as an example. This is um a colostrum spoon. And this shows you actually how much a baby needs with breast milk within the first 24 to 48 hours. So sometimes mom gets discouraged with breastfeeding, feeling like she isn't producing enough milk. But when you see the newborn formula bottles, you thinking, oh my goodness, I have to produce that much milk. And all honesty, this is all the baby needs. Right? And so if mom can't see it, then she's thinking, I'm not producing enough milk. This isn't working for me. I'ma stop breastfeeding. That isn't the case. This is all the baby needs. And we are able to produce it, but if you can't see it, that I think that's a huge hindrance. So I like to have, I'm a visual learner myself. So I like to have visuals to be able to say, hey, you can do that. You can do it. Encourage don't work. Exactly. Pressure out there. And that's what breastfeeding is all about, encouraging. Because your body is created for it. But how can you actually do it if you don't know? You know? And self-talk is big. So even in the birthing space, I always say we have to have positive words. So we do affirmation cards as well. I work with mom and dad. We're doing affirmation cards. And then I always encourage them to have a date night where they do that together. Yeah, play a favorite song. I know one of the beautiful moments I had in the birthing space was that dad started reading mom the affirmation cards. And it's just like the love, you can see it all in the room. It just overflows.

SPEAKER_03 26:24

So how can people get in contact with you? Or how would you like the you'd like people to refer you? Yeah. How does that work?

SPEAKER_04 26:31

Yeah. So actually, I'm a board member with the Black Doolus of Columbia. Okay. So if you go on our website, we have all our contact information there. Um I can also leave my number. Um Did I get the number on here? Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 26:44

Yeah. Okay. Of course.

SPEAKER_04 26:48

You can always contact me. Um, Texas Better at 803-440-9973. And you're specializing in postpartum care and lactation.

unknown 27:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 27:00

Okay. Well, thank you. But I want to know if you guys have any questions that you would like to ask.

SPEAKER_00 27:06

Anybody on my, yeah. Anybody on the I mean, we had a we had a midwife with Io. Um, so so I've already been through all of this, but I feel like a lot of what people don't realize is the the knowledge and the information leading up beforehand that we were really not getting from the traditional medical system. Because we we were doing both at the same time for a while. Um and then we ended up having him at home in a birthing pool uh with a midwife. But um just just really having being prepared for uh all the aspects of pregnancy, I think is really important.

SPEAKER_04 27:46

And that's what we're there for. We're there to empower, educate, and just to help them through the process. So one thing about being a duel is that I would teach you how to advocate for yourself, but I'm never gonna speak for you. Never. Because that would be just like me taking your voice away. And if I speak for you this time, if you need to advocate for yourself another time, how will you do it?

SPEAKER_02 28:09

That's true.

SPEAKER_04 28:10

So that's one thing we believe in educating and empowering.

unknown 28:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 28:14

That's good, especially in in those situations, anything could happen, like you said earlier.

SPEAKER_04 28:18

Yeah, yeah, and then have that confidence to know, hey, this is my body and I feel X, Y, and Z. You are the only person that knows your body inside and out, you know?

SPEAKER_03 28:29

They said also to explain the level of pain too. Yes, like on a scale to one to ten, because everybody doesn't know what you're experiencing.

SPEAKER_04 28:36

Right. And sometimes if you say, I'm hurting how this feels like X, Y, and Z. When even I um inform consent. So I even teach my clients that if you don't want to be touched, it's okay. You can always say, Hey, can you tell me what you're doing? Because sometimes you have hospital staff that would come in and just start touching mom and moving her around. And it's okay to say, Hey, tell me what you're doing. You know, it's okay to ask questions because at the end of the day, it's your body. Yeah.

unknown 29:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 29:11

This has been an awesome episode.

SPEAKER_04 29:12

Yeah, thank y'all for having me.

SPEAKER_02 29:14

Yes, yes. Thank you for being a guest.

SPEAKER_01 29:16

Uh hey, hey, I didn't want to jump in. Go ahead. My wife, she wants, she's, we're trying to have a baby, and she says she needs a midwife. I was just uh sending her some videos for you, and she said, ooh, she sounds like she knows what she's talking about.

SPEAKER_04 29:29

But I'm a doula, but I can refer her to some awesome midwives.

SPEAKER_02 29:33

Awesome.

SPEAKER_04 29:33

Yeah.

unknown 29:36

All right.

SPEAKER_02 29:36

So with that said, um, this has been um another episode of Hill Top Glove Podcast. I want to thank uh Shannon and Allen for joining us today. Thank y'all for having me. Likewise. And with that said, I'm Skip.

SPEAKER_03 29:48

Tamaya.

SPEAKER_02 29:49

This is Mike.

unknown 29:50

TJ and what?

SPEAKER_02 29:51

Aaron, what's the whole thing that you say? You got the whole rap there.

SPEAKER_03 29:55

Oh, he says, I got it. Tell someone you love them and like and subscribe and tune into the next episode.